Pricing a damaged car

[gregc]

Hi there - I've been driving a 2011 Optima Turbo since new - still love the car so I'm not in a hurry to make a move unless it's a great deal. That said, I've had the High-chroma red GT2 as my desktop wallpaper since the Stinger came out

I learned that a dealer near me has an early run 2018 GT2 AWD in red that's been on their lot since 8/2017. Car is still new, hasn't been registered to anyone.

I'm in Massachusetts for what it's worth, and I've bought 3 cars from this dealer since 2011.

While on the lot the car was hit and had some body repairs done.

I went in with my son to look at a Sportage and offhandedly asked about the Stinger. Took a quick spin, when the sales guy took it out he mentioned that it hadn't been started in a while.

He then proceeded to offer me the same deal that was listed on cargurus.com for the car... they moved about $500 without much effort. I looked at numbers and the buyout doesn't seem to be as helpful in MA with our tax setup.....so I moved to buy & finance:

52300 MSRP
-6406 discount
-5500 Rebate (KMF + loyalty)
2524.625 Sales Tax
449 Dealer Fee
200 Reg etc
43567.63 Net Price
3.90% APR
($734.51) Monthly


I said I'd think about it and did some research, finding that there are unblemished 2018 AWD GT2s available from many dealers near me for similar deals. After considering it some more I spoke with the sales guy and told him this would be what I'm looking for:
$52,300.00 MSRP
-$6,406.00 Same discount you'd give anyone on any SGT2
-$5,000.00 Discount - damaged and repaired
-$2,000.00 Discount - early run car 18mos old, hadn't even been started recently
-$2,000.00 Discount - this is our 4th car bought&serviced from you since 2011
-$3,000.00 Kia cash - Kia owner loyalty - 2011 Optima SX
$2,118.38 Sales Tax
$449.00 Your doc fee
$200.00 Reg fees - TC plate
$36,661.38 Total
$0.00 down
0% KMF Low Rate code 500 66mos @ 0.0%
($555.48) Monthly

Other concerns: Confirm actual mileage on the car
I want to inspect the car on lift at delivery
Please provide pictures of the damage before delivery
Oil change before delivery
4-wheel alignment must be done/checked before or immediately after delivery
All recalls/TSBs done before or immediately after delivery
Confirm that the car still qualifies for Kia 50/50 100/100 and dealer lifetime powertrain warranty

Naturally he called back and told me that they don't have $9k to move on this car. He didn't make a counter offer. Obviously if this doesn't get done before 1/2 we're looking at different incentives and a different deal.

Two questions come up:
-Dealers with damaged cars get insurance $ to repair the care and compensate for lost value, no? It seems like double-dipping to expect me to pay same price as an undamaged car....but what's the right discount?
-WHEN will dealers start discounting 18 month old cars? Is there some kind of accounting magic where they're better to hold the car and pretend it's still worth $52k? At this rate I'll probably end up looking at a 2019 or something else in a few months.

Am I off-base here?

Thx

Greg C

 

[MurlinatoR]

Hi there - I've been driving a 2011 Optima Turbo since new - still love the car so I'm not in a hurry to make a move unless it's a great deal. That said, I've had the High-chroma red GT2 as my desktop wallpaper since the Stinger came out

I learned that a dealer near me has an early run 2018 GT2 AWD in red that's been on their lot since 8/2017. Car is still new, hasn't been registered to anyone.

I'm in Massachusetts for what it's worth, and I've bought 3 cars from this dealer since 2011.

While on the lot the car was hit and had some body repairs done.

I went in with my son to look at a Sportage and offhandedly asked about the Stinger. Took a quick spin, when the sales guy took it out he mentioned that it hadn't been started in a while.

He then proceeded to offer me the same deal that was listed on cargurus.com for the car... they moved about $500 without much effort. I looked at numbers and the buyout doesn't seem to be as helpful in MA with our tax setup.....so I moved to buy & finance:

52300 MSRP
-6406 discount
-5500 Rebate (KMF + loyalty)
2524.625 Sales Tax
449 Dealer Fee
200 Reg etc
43567.63 Net Price
3.90% APR
($734.51) Monthly


I said I'd think about it and did some research, finding that there are unblemished 2018 AWD GT2s available from many dealers near me for similar deals. After considering it some more I spoke with the sales guy and told him this would be what I'm looking for:
$52,300.00 MSRP
-$6,406.00 Same discount you'd give anyone on any SGT2
-$5,000.00 Discount - damaged and repaired
-$2,000.00 Discount - early run car 18mos old, hadn't even been started recently
-$2,000.00 Discount - this is our 4th car bought&serviced from you since 2011
-$3,000.00 Kia cash - Kia owner loyalty - 2011 Optima SX
$2,118.38 Sales Tax
$449.00 Your doc fee
$200.00 Reg fees - TC plate
$36,661.38 Total
$0.00 down
0% KMF Low Rate code 500 66mos @ 0.0%
($555.48) Monthly

Other concerns: Confirm actual mileage on the car
I want to inspect the car on lift at delivery
Please provide pictures of the damage before delivery
Oil change before delivery
4-wheel alignment must be done/checked before or immediately after delivery
All recalls/TSBs done before or immediately after delivery
Confirm that the car still qualifies for Kia 50/50 100/100 and dealer lifetime powertrain warranty

Naturally he called back and told me that they don't have $9k to move on this car. He didn't make a counter offer. Obviously if this doesn't get done before 1/2 we're looking at different incentives and a different deal.

Two questions come up:
-Dealers with damaged cars get insurance $ to repair the care and compensate for lost value, no? It seems like double-dipping to expect me to pay same price as an undamaged car....but what's the right discount?
-WHEN will dealers start discounting 18 month old cars? Is there some kind of accounting magic where they're better to hold the car and pretend it's still worth $52k? At this rate I'll probably end up looking at a 2019 or something else in a few months.

Am I off-base here?

Thx

Greg C

Hey there [MENTION=1948]gregc[/MENTION], happy new years eve!!!

So, I have been a Kia dealer since 2001. Here's a couple of things to consider based on your thoughts above.

First, and your SECOND question, is to remember that they are already discounting the car more than six THOUSAND dollars! You ask when they will start discounting an old car when, in reality, they are and VERY aggressively. Consider that $70,000 GM trucks max out at around $12,000 off when blown out. Here you have a $50,000 car with $12,000 off. Sound's like all of the money to me.

Second, and your first question LOL, is to think about this from a different angle. Let's imagine that YOUR 2011 Optima had been in an accident. You took it to a body shop and had the vehicle repaired to your very strict requirements. At a later time, you want to sell your Optima and the buyer asks you if it's been in any wrecks... Your honest answer is yes and that the repair has brought the vehicle back to like original condition. HOW MUCH would you expect the potential buyer to reduce his paying price??? I can tell you that the real market value adjustment to a vehicle with an accident in it's history is in the range of $500 if the repair has been completed properly.

THIS is the key. If they had left the Stinger damaged and tried to sell it that way, then YES they should very heavily reduce the price of the car as you've requested. They turned it in to insurance. The shop repaired the new car. The insurance company covered the cost of repair. Ultimately, as long as someone is putting money back into the value to repair the car, the value remains fairly constant.

 

[gregc]

I appreciate the perspective. I had seen discussion in other places that a damaged car should be discounted and thoroughly inspected....was hoping for a really good deal given my budget doesn't really have an extra Stinger payment for a few months...would have to be a killer deal for me to bite right now anyway.
[MENTION=291]MurlinatoR[/MENTION] Thanks and Happy New Year!

 

[nhcowboy28]

A lot depends on what kind of damage was incurred. Minor body damage, structural, electonics involved... etc.

 

[gregc]

So, I saw the new lease offers and texted my guy back. I said I had talked with a friend who thought I was asking too much discount and apologized.

I asked if he could do this:
$52,300.00 MSRP
-$6,406.00 Standard discount on SGT2 (listed on dealer website)
-$2,000.00 Dicount - damaged and repaired
-$1,000.00 Discount - early run car 18mos old
-$1,000.00 Discount - this is our 4th car bought&serviced from you since 2011
-$9,700.00 24 Mo Lease Cash
$2,012.13 Sales Tax
$449.00 Doc Fee
$140.00 Reg fees - TC plate
$34,795.13 Total
$0.00 down
4% CU offers 3.5%/66 mos
($580.33) Monthly loan after buyout

24 mo lease would be $350-410/mo

He said no, he could probably do $500+/- from his original $6400 discount. I asked to see their worksheet with the best deal he could do.

Will keep you posted. I asked for quotes on a couple other cars nearby......

Thx

Greg C

 

[gregc]

Looks like they're offering about $7900 in total discount then the lease cash.

The lease deal is pretty disappointing at $585/mo but it looks like we are at about $36k to lease them buy out. Still feels like I should be able to do better at this point.

TIA for any feedback!

 

[MurlinatoR]

[MENTION=1948]gregc[/MENTION], hey bud. You're still thousands of dollars off. All of the extra $4,000 that you're asking for is money that doesn't exist unless the car has been titled and has thus depreciated.

Don't take this the wrong way but your actions are some of the most frustrating to the sales industry. LOL

 

[MurlinatoR]

Looks like they're offering about $7900 in total discount then the lease cash.

The lease deal is pretty disappointing at $585/mo but it looks like we are at about $36k to lease them buy out. Still feels like I should be able to do better at this point.

TIA for any feedback!

View attachment 1931

It's a 24 month lease. Of course the payments are higher. LOL

Dude, that's a killer deal on that Stinger.

 

[gregc]

Thanks again for the feedback. I talked with my salesman and leased the car without further squirming. The extra $1000 discount plus extra lease cash puts the buyout (or even residual purchase) where I wanted to be.

I looked over the repairs: substantial damage to the right side but work looks to be done well (lines are dead on and no trace of blends)

I'm going to get ready to enjoy my car.
Thanks for the advice!

 

[MurlinatoR]

Nice car [MENTION=1948]gregc[/MENTION]! Congratulations!